5-6 month LLLT results

   
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BaldbeGone

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August 01, 2010, 04:49 PM

Ok everyone so I’ve been using the Laser Messiah 300 along with clays, Polysorbate 80,various supplements and Mag Oil and natural topicals (No minox/propecia/synthetics), and eating healthy. since around February 15th my results so far.


Month 1- Noticed increased volume, shine, and density. No regrowth.

Month 2. Noticed increasingly better results in these areas. Also faster hair growth. No regrowth.

Month 3. Hit a relatively small shed around month 2 and a half and it continued until month 3 almost month 4. The shed was bad for me (What shed isn’t bad for us?) The hair that shed was, however in my weaker temporal areas. Since I don’t have loss anywhere else I was encouraged because this meant that my weak thinning hairs were being replaced. My other hair elsewhere was in prime shape.

Month 4. Little vellus hairs appeared everywhere the initial hair shed. Looked promising. Regrowth. But then towards the end…Dun Dun Dun…Another shed.

Month 5. Huge HORRIBLE Shed, mostly in the front weaker areas. All vellus hairs shed. and existing hair seemed alot thinner. Where the first shed was not noticeable to others, this one could have been. ALARMING to say the least…but now that month 6 is approaching shedding has dramatically slowed compared to initial weeks and HOLY SHIT. DARK HAIRS ARE SPROUTING EVERYWHERE in my temple areas. Now I understand the reason for the huge shed. Bye Bye Vellus hairs. Hello terminal ones. The hair on the rest of my scalp is amazing. Although I keep my hair short, I can tell if I grew it out, it would be very thick now, but the temple areas needs a few months (3-6 months for full cosmetic effect. 1 full year for excellence lol)

By February I expect a very nicely grown in hairline, although not perfect (3 year window…*sigh*), and a MANE! Now I understand the reason for the shed. I welcome it now in fact. More hair shedding means more and BETTER hair where there CAN BE hair, and if it just fell out of that part of your scalp, there can DEFINITELY be hair there if you CONTINUE USING your regimen!

Some topicals I used before and after LLLT which I used for 15 or 20 minute sessions every other or every other two days ARE…100% Aloe Vera gel, pharmaceutical grade Emu-Oil, Mag Oil (although I’ve long since stopped), POLYSORBATE 80!! (I have reason to believe this increased my shed, but I THANK IT!) I’ve read many great things about this so I am sticking by it until February for optimal results. I use this right before (Well I shampoo it out of course) LLLT religiously sometimes for 30minutes-1hour and sometimes I leave it in all night and shower in the morning and then laser. It’s just as good as clays for getting rid of that dirt, sebum, DHT so LLLT can penetrate well. It also has some hair restoring and regrowing properties of its own based on some conclusive studies. It kind of smells and its texture is that of someone just nutted in your hair but ITS dirt cheap with minimal side effects and great pros. Right before the almighty laser messiah graces my head I run through my scalp with some Aloe Vera gel to moisturize the scalp. I heard it ALSO has some benefit against hair loss. After my session I apply a thin coat of emu Oil to my scalp temporal areas. I mix mag oil with my OJ or juice for better results now, rather than apply it topically. I heard some good arguments for it somewhere here in the forums.

So in Conclusion——My hair is at its worst state but also at its POTENTIAL BEST… at month 5 and a half when I look now where new vellus hairs are forming and where dark hairs are filling in the spot they PREVIOUSLY formed—I GET GIDDY!  By Next summer, I’m hoping with at least two more sheds and regrowths, I will look like Apollo.

I will take pics soon but I just believe you can judge it that well. The best judge is you…and a microscope. Some Advice…dont count hairs, dont be scared of sheds, be patient, be consistent, avoid stress.


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OverMachoGrande

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# 1 ]

August 01, 2010, 05:38 PM

Hey, BaldbeGone!

It’s so unfair that sheds have to happen like that when something works, but hey… it works, and obviously I KNOW that LLLT from devices like my laser helmet and clinical lasers that get the right amounts of energy work better than pretty much anything else!  It makes sense that this would be “news” for the hair loss world since SO MUCH SHIT DOESN’T WORK.  It just DOESN’T! lol…

I had a really noticeable shed at the 13 month point -then a smaller one at about the 25 month point (both in January).  I *probably* had one at the two or three month point when I started, but I had already trained myself not to look in the mirror very much, and frankly my hair was already so crappy that I don’t know if I would have noticed anyway! 

But remember guys… this is NOT that bullshit that was talked about at another forum last year -that just HAPPENED to start after the debacle at another forum, and just HAPPENED to end when a competitor started selling a laser helmet of their own. That was total CRAP.

What’s really funny is that forum has OUTRIGHT LLLT shills now.  Look at this post about laser helmets:

Ok, see, all of *us* are educated in LLLT, so we know that what he says in that post and all of his other 20-something posts of outright shilling is utter b*llshit.  People like that need the noose around their neck.

So, you’ve got the OUTRIGHT shills their now… am I to believe that there weren’t UNDERCOVER shills before?  Maybe this guy, maybe others (definitely one other).  Of course there were.  Hey, moderating is hard work so I’m not knocking Jacob and I don’t even want him to get involved in this discussion because he’s not passionate about LLLT -which is why shills like that fag in the PDF above and those couple of drama shedders weren’t taken care of properly in the first place and allowed to run rampant -not to mention the forum owner is the only person on that site that has true moderator powers, and he’s too absent to sit there and research proxies, patterns, and ips like I do.  He’s a fantastic guy and one of my friends, but he didn’t take care of the shill problems there -nor even enable Jacob to be able to.

I’m making an article on “common LLLT Deception”, and this and other things will be chronicled!

But back to the point, that’s FANTASTIC that you’ve got a lot of terminal hairs and things look great!  I’m telling you, though, I don’t know why every single person on this forum that has room in their regimen isn’t using Zix.  More than just me have reported that shedding is radically reduced on it.  It’s something that most of us notice within WEEKS, too.  No clue why, it just happens.

Sounds like you are doing a lot of the RIGHT THINGS with LLLT, though!  That’s great!  I hate answering emails from people that say “Hey, OMG, I made my device and have been using it for 45 minutes every day, and I don’t know why I’m not getting results!” lol…

By the way, worthy of mention… the people that OVERUSE LLLT like that don’t get sheds.  Why?  Because it’s not working! lol… 

-O.M.G.

PS- Baldbegone, I’m sorry I had to deviate in the middle like that, but the thing is… people read this, then they EMAIL ME about it instead of post here.  So, I wanted to cover my bases in advance!


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jdp710

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# 2 ]

August 01, 2010, 05:53 PM

OverMachoGrande - August 01, 2010, 05:38 PM

By the way, worthy of mention… the people that OVERUSE LLLT like that don’t get sheds.  Why?  Because it’s not working! lol…


Great quote!  Quoting to show importance.

 

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OverMachoGrande

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August 01, 2010, 06:06 PM

Yeah, thanks, I actually patted myself on the back for the simplicity and elegance of that one!  lol…  I needed a good way to really make that point!  I speak to people all the time that overuse LLLT to extremes -and they NEVER get sheds OR results!

LLLT, in and of itself, has zero effect on shedding.  Go overuse MINOXIDIL and see if you get that same reaction! lol…

-O.M.G.


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jdp710

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# 4 ]

August 01, 2010, 10:53 PM

lol, you know, with that one quote, you explained it better than I ever could and better than I ever have. 

 

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Joey Ramone

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# 5 ]

August 02, 2010, 05:36 AM

I think jacob is happy letting them post as long as they’re open and forthright about who they are and their financial interest in hair loss.  Personally I don’t have a problem with this though I’d prefer not to see it here.

On that johnsp guy though, he is at least using about 160 650nm diodes instead of one diode in a handheld so it’s gotta at least be the best of a bad bunch yeh? Still very expensive of course and I haven’t read through most of his posts so maybe I’m missing something here.

edit: just read the PDF lol.  What a cheeky little mongrel.

 

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Joey Ramone

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# 6 ]

August 02, 2010, 05:38 AM

Oh, thanks to Baldbegone for the update too.  Pretty keen to try out the poly80 as a pre-laser thingy.

Which emu and mag oils are you using?

 

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jads

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# 7 ]

August 02, 2010, 06:10 AM

Baldbegone, that sounds pretty encouraging. Great stuff!  How long have you been fighting hair loss for?  5 years plus?

Thanks
Jads

 

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BaldbeGone

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# 8 ]

August 02, 2010, 06:55 PM

Yea Poly80’s really good imo as a pre laser topical, anything that causes CHANGE to my hair I consider it good. That is, if it’s known for having negligible negative side effects (These usually tend to be natural products/treatments lol)


I’m 21 years of and counting and have been fighting/noticing my hair loss for about 4 years since I was 17. I only recently started the LLLT and aggressive relentless multi-pronged approach since Feb ‘10 and I’ve seen the most drastic changes to my scalp since then. I honestly believe that if I continue with this treatment by this time next year, as far as my vanity is concerned lol, I will have no personal problems with my scalp.

So I’ve HAD hair loss for about 3-4 years, the first 2 years being small loss in the front I could do without and the following one half year being slightly more aggressive, which prompted me to find a good treatment ASAP. So I’m relatively quick to catch my loss and now that this site is in full gear and with so much good information, I feel pretty lucky.


I use pharmaceutical grade emu oil off this one guys site, prehistoric ultimate mag oil that was recommended/featured somewhere here on this site WHICH I TAKE INTERNALLY not topically anymore…nasty taste, and aloe Vera gel right before laser sessions. And a little emu oil in the trouble spots right after.

I know it has to do with the extent of your loss, but if you’ve been losing it 5 years or less, expect great great results…just not immediately. Most of those “stages” of treatment were off for me and it just depends on YOU and your scalp. Mines is probably going to take the full 12 months to see the results and then another year to see how amazing it can get after a few more good sheds!


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Mastery

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# 9 ]

August 02, 2010, 07:16 PM

jdp710 - August 01, 2010, 10:53 PM

lol, you know, with that one quote, you explained it better than I ever could and better than I ever have. 

jdp & OMG - I had fantastic results with OMG’s laser helmet until the summer humidity in Florida really kicked in, and as I’m without AC (I’m chemically sensitive to it for some weird reason) my scalp has been producing sebum like there is no tomrrow. I read one of your posts jdp70 about high sebum production having high DHT - I think you said is this the only time to be cautious with LLLT?

I’m thinking of heading north or west with my trusted laser helmet to get away from the humidity.

I think scalp lady has fantastic ideas to reduce sebum production.

OMG & jdp - any comments to help my understanding. Many thanks…

 

 

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OverMachoGrande

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August 02, 2010, 07:51 PM

BaldbeGone - August 02, 2010, 06:55 PM

Yea Poly80’s really good imo as a pre laser topical, anything that causes CHANGE to my hair I consider it good. That is, if it’s known for having negligible negative side effects (These usually tend to be natural products/treatments lol)

...

I use pharmaceutical grade emu oil off this one guys site, prehistoric ultimate mag oil that was recommended/featured somewhere here on this site WHICH I TAKE INTERNALLY not topically anymore…nasty taste, and aloe Vera gel right before laser sessions. And a little emu oil in the trouble spots right after.

Man, for those of you that are out there that HAVEN’T used Polysorbate 80 in conjunction with lasers, you need to start!  I can count the number of times that I *haven’t* used it (or clay, but I don’t use the clay nearly as much) before the shower I take before I use the laser helmet ON ONE HAND!  Literally… I pretty much don’t do the laser treatment without having used it beforehand.

Also, can you give a link to the emu?  I need to get some more, and I might as well try another brand to compare.  I’ve use longviewfarms.com in the past -and although it doesn’t have a huge part in my regimen, I like having it onhand and occasionally use it.

-O.M.G.


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SolitaireCloneInX

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# 11 ]

August 02, 2010, 08:18 PM

Baldbegone, thanks for the big update. I’m in my second month of LLLT and have noticed shedding starting, and like you have stayed positive, knowing that shedding means healthier, thicker hair is coming in afterward. Your post helped solidify my positive frame of mind! Thanks.


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BaldbeGone

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# 12 ]

August 02, 2010, 10:45 PM

Correction on that…I’ve been using my “protocol” since Feb ‘10. I"ll just go back and edit that…

The emu oil I use can be found on this guy’s site—-http://www.hairloss-research.org/shop/?——...His other protocols also gave me some good ideas. You can find those on his home site. I’ve even spoken to him. Knows his stuff

No problem, Solitaire! I just want to reassure people that shedding is a good thing and that LLLT, although a great treatment, takes sooooo much f$$^$%n time, consistence, and patience! Anything that doesn’t require work, be that “mentally” or physically, never indicated anything with worthwhile outcomes so far in my life so I’m sticking to my hair experience as further proof of that.

By the way OMG, you’re definitely right about overusing LLLT. Sometimes after even 15minutes my head wouldn’t “thump” with the same intensity. Sometimes it took 20 minutes. I’m pretty comfortable with the messiah now so I just let my scalp tell me when its good, but I usually rock it for a good 15-20 minutes


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BaldbeGone

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# 13 ]

August 02, 2010, 10:46 PM

Mastery - August 02, 2010, 07:16 PM

jdp710 - August 01, 2010, 10:53 PM

lol, you know, with that one quote, you explained it better than I ever could and better than I ever have. 

jdp & OMG - I had fantastic results with OMG’s laser helmet until the summer humidity in Florida really kicked in, and as I’m without AC (I’m chemically sensitive to it for some weird reason) my scalp has been producing sebum like there is no tomrrow. I read one of your posts jdp70 about high sebum production having high DHT - I think you said is this the only time to be cautious with LLLT?

I’m thinking of heading north or west with my trusted laser helmet to get away from the humidity.

I think scalp lady has fantastic ideas to reduce sebum production.

OMG & jdp - any comments to help my understanding. Many thanks…

 


GET ON THAT POLYSORBATE 80!!!


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Mastery

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# 14 ]

August 02, 2010, 11:06 PM

OK, help me understand… - does Polysorbate 80 lower the sebum production or counteract the DHT or something else? What am I missing…or not understanding?

Thanks in advance…

 

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WinterHeart

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August 03, 2010, 01:29 AM

Man that sounds pretty sweet, but how come you didn’t take any pics??  You should totally take some right now, so that in 6 month you can post them so that people can compare!

Anyways. You guys ever seen the movie “Click” with Adam Sandlers? He had a magical remote control that allowed him to fast forward through time… well, that’s what I wish I had right now!
I’ve only just finished the first month, and it’s crazy how slowly time passes when you’re waiting for something…

I took really detailed pictures of my hair line from every angle, and will take more every 3 months or so! I hope they’ll shut up the “LLLT is shit because there aren’t any good pictures of results!!!” whiners that I’ve seen on some boards.

 

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Joey Ramone

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August 03, 2010, 03:50 AM

.

 

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BaldbeGone

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August 03, 2010, 09:29 AM

Haha believe it or not WinterHeart I was kind of scared of taking before and afters because I did not want to be disappointed. However, now that you mention that I think I will since my hair is at its “worst” right now and follow it up with some pics in three months, 6 months, 9 months, and one year. As you say Pics for all the “whiners”!

So I’d have completely skipped the first 6 months in terms of progress but those were kind of boring anyway lol


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jads

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August 06, 2010, 06:47 AM

baldbegone,

stay positive mate and good things will happen!  Interesting talk re Poly 80. It’s part of the topical scalp stimulator \cleanser I’m using with the clinic treatment right now. I think it’s definitely beneficial prior to a laser session. My 10 week checkup showed pretty amazing reduction in scalp DHT using just the topicals, laser and a natural DHT blocker.

BTW, the clinic can’t stress enough that the one key thing is ‘consistency’!  Consistency with the laser, scalp hygiene and DHT reduction; the rest hopefully looks after itself.

Almost 3 months into laser and I can’t wait to see how things look in 5-6 months!

 

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WinterHeart

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# 19 ]

August 06, 2010, 07:18 AM

Hey, I was wondering,

How does your scalp feel when you’re shedding because of the helmet?

Do you still have that weird “tickle” or kind of mild itch that indicates that a hair is being shed? You know,  when you scratch that spot, and look between your fingers, sure enough, there’s your hair, right from that exact spot?

Well, after 1 month plus a week, I found that I barely get any of that anymore! Usually, the hair I shed is now weaker than it was before, and I usually don’t feel the “itch” that would’ve otherwise told me that a hair was getting shed.
How about you guys?

That’s pretty much the difference that I’ve noticed so far (I’ve also been on the first 6 immortal hair vitamins for about 2 months). That, and also how my frontal hair looks “bigger”, even though there has obviously not been any regrowth yet, it’s like it’s fuller and less flat than it was.

 

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BaldbeGone

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# 20 ]

August 07, 2010, 11:43 AM

Well *IN MY OPINION* we’re all catching our hairloss at different times so it’s only natural that some of us shed later/earlier/more/twice than others. Who knows your hair might have already been in the Telogen phase, whereas my hair just got out of it and went right back thanks to LLLT. I dont know.

As for my scalp…it doesn’t really itch, it feels great, when hair does shed it’s usually just shed. BTW everyone my shedding has completely stopped…well besides the normal oh there goes a few hairs shedding. It lasted about 3~ weeks from what I can remember. Now I know after you shed, your hairs are just in your scalp for a while relaxing lol before they come out and BAM! but does anyone know how long this takes?

OH AND FLUORESCENT LIGHTS SUCK!


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Mastery

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# 21 ]

August 16, 2010, 06:52 AM

jads - August 06, 2010, 06:47 AM

baldbegone,

stay positive mate and good things will happen!  Interesting talk re Poly 80. It’s part of the topical scalp stimulator \cleanser I’m using with the clinic treatment right now. I think it’s definitely beneficial prior to a laser session. My 10 week checkup showed pretty amazing reduction in scalp DHT using just the topicals, laser and a natural DHT blocker.

BTW, the clinic can’t stress enough that the one key thing is ‘consistency’!  Consistency with the laser, scalp hygiene and DHT reduction; the rest hopefully looks after itself.

Almost 3 months into laser and I can’t wait to see how things look in 5-6 months!


I’d be very interested to know, which clinic are you going to?

Many thanks for sharing…

 

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tanner84

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# 22 ]

May 08, 2012, 10:02 PM

Baldbegone - how are things going with your hair now? It’s been a while since your post

 

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jkenn

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# 23 ]

May 10, 2012, 12:06 AM

jads - August 06, 2010, 06:47 AM

baldbegone,

  Interesting talk re Poly 80. It’s part of the topical scalp stimulator \cleanser I’m using with the clinic treatment right now. I think it’s definitely beneficial prior to a laser session. My 10 week checkup showed pretty amazing reduction in scalp DHT using just the topicals, laser and a natural DHT blocker.

BTW, the clinic can’t stress enough that the one key thing is ‘consistency’!  Consistency with the laser, scalp hygiene and DHT reduction; the rest hopefully looks after itself.

Almost 3 months into laser and I can’t wait to see how things look in 5-6 months!

Jads, are you using an internal or topical dht blocker?

 

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tanner84

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May 10, 2012, 08:17 AM

I am gonna predict that a clinic has him on both internal and external DHT blockers… but jkenn - his last post on this thread was 2 years ago. If i were you, I’d stick with the topical DHT blocker, and if you have an extreme case, do a topical DHT blocker twice a day. I wouldn’t mess with the internal stuff unless you are ready to deal with what happens when you mess with hormones.

 

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marb

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# 25 ]

September 11, 2012, 02:38 PM

I have just passed the 6 month stage with my 50 diode device (switched over 3 areas of scalp 20 mins each) and up to now I have no visible progress. If anything, my hair seems thinner and I am noticing hair falling out but I will carry on. I was hoping to see results in 2-3 months like some of the clinic’s websites but reading posts above this isn’t really the case.

 

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dZine

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# 26 ]

September 16, 2012, 04:17 PM

yeah..well. I am on 12 months now using 430 diodes and still no noticable results. It might have slowed it down but nothing major..

Anyhow, try to hang in there. Results can take up to 18 months:O

 

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marb

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# 27 ]

September 17, 2012, 03:43 AM

I will wink

 

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marb

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# 28 ]

September 29, 2012, 05:57 AM

Ok, I am just about at 7 months and I have started in the last few weeks to shed like crazy. This wasn’t in the script ohh

 

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vulture

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# 29 ]

September 29, 2012, 05:04 PM

I am finding that laser therapy (I am at around 8 months on the laser messiah with pulse drive and apply pre-topicals - polysorbate 80, emu oil, niacin powder in distilled water - before each use) will not yield the desired result (hair regrowth) without also using other therapies concurrently.  I have finally regrown hair on my crown and can see it coming all the way back to where I was- NW 2 in another few months.  I attribute this mainly to my using the helmet 3 times a week and a daily application of Lipogaine.

 

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Rothman

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# 30 ]

October 01, 2012, 09:40 AM

marb - September 29, 2012, 05:57 AM

Ok, I am just about at 7 months and I have started in the last few weeks to shed like crazy. This wasn’t in the script ohh

The shed could be due to a new growth cycle. My last shed was horrible, the worst I’ve ever experienced. I was about to give up all treatments and just accept defeat. As it turns out, it was a new cycle. My hair is now much thicker and healthier with a lot of terminal looking hairs coming up all over. In the front and temple area the new growth has more than made up for the horrendous shed, the crown suffered quite a bit during the last shed and is still lagging. I could not ask for much more if things continue this way.

Hang in there.

 

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marb

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# 31 ]

October 02, 2012, 01:34 PM

I hope so. It’s in terrible condition too. When I first started using the lasers it got in good condition. Just hope things pick up.

 

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TrueGround

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# 32 ]

October 06, 2012, 11:48 AM

Rothman,

Do you use a pulse drive or a standard power supply?

 

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