“EXPERTS DISCOVER ROOT CAUSE OF BALDNESS” - BBC

   
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Mastery

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January 04, 2011, 08:30 PM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-12112673

Hmmmn.

OMG, jdp, IH, Bid, Zix - views???

M

 

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# 1 ]

January 04, 2011, 10:48 PM

Hi Mastery. Basically they said what we already know. The follilicles are still alive but miniaturized. We already know this miniturization is caused mostly by DHT. Here’s three reasons why I believe it will always be impossible to get these follicles to ever grow terminal hairs.

1. They’re too small. Hair follicles are “organelles” or tiny organs. They are complicated systems. When they become miniaturized to a point, certain structures are ruined beyond repair. A kidney can still be alive yet destroyed beyond the point where it can ever carry out it’s normal function again. Although it’s hard to accept, many things in the body can be damaged beyond repair.

2. The follicles are encapsulated in fibrosis as well. To get them to grow we would have to overcome this problem which, despite arguments to the contrary, I still don’t believe is possible.

3. The fact that the follicle is miniaturized means we would have to cut DHT beyond any sort of realistic expectation. The smaller they get the less DHT is required to keep them miniaturized. Even if you create a brand new follicle E.G. with dermaroller this follicle would still carry the same genetic predisposition. Also being brand new it would be a miniaturized follicle and not be able to produce a hair. That’s why a baby tends to be born bald. Their follicles need to mature. But with adults this will never happen because even the smallest amount of DHT will keep them in a miniaturized state. So perhaps it is possible through gentle wounding to cause the body to make new follicles but they will still never grow up to grow hair.

Just my humble opinion for what it’s worth.

 

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Lapwing

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# 2 ]

January 04, 2011, 11:50 PM

Extraordinarily disappointing and misleading as usual.  I discovered the real reason, people go bald because people go bald.  Oh yeah, it may run in families too.  Now where is my big check?

 

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actionreaction

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# 3 ]

January 04, 2011, 11:51 PM

If I’ve learned anything from IH.org it’s that when you’re looking for the root causes of hairloss, you’re only going to get so far by looking at the scalp.


Of a suprahuman immensity in a patch of sand or a raptors guileless shivering intensity, I’m only a visitor,
an atom of atoms on a jutting red splattered synagogue of granite as it crouches literally in space
A frozen amoral giant gazing heavenward, forever

 

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Mastery

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# 4 ]

January 05, 2011, 01:02 AM

I agree with all of that.

But not to give too much away, I have met a company that are doing stem cell trials to regrow hair and they are totally confident that it works. They have invested considerable money in it and are now doing the trials, we should get the answer in about a year - but they are almost blaze confident given the initial successful results. Who knows?

Please don’t ask for names, as I can not say anything more as I am under an NDA.

Still, even if it works, IMHO that’s cheating! Instead I’m all for doing it internally as the holy grail. That is what really floats my boat… - using all our applications to heal ourselves. As to me it can actually help us with our health.

Now check this work out out - find a slant board, say 45 degrees - the kind you do sit ups on, right? hook your legs over and lean back and have say 30 lb dumbells in each hand. Start my doing decline press - and you will feel all the blood rush to your head. Then increase te weighs sreadily with each set say up to 40 - 50 lbs. Start lower if you need to. Do this ervy day for 5 - 10 minutes, and se how your har resopnds to that intense pressure of blood to teh scalp. It is working so well for me.

Then, take it further. Within a couple of weeks / months your body will get used to that. Then take an olympic bar (on the same upside down slant broad) and do over heads with narrow grip or wide grip - alternate as you let the bar go with straight arms over your head. The rush of blood to the scalp is even more intense.

So say, do 6 sets twice a day - 3 sets of each.

M

 

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# 5 ]

January 05, 2011, 01:03 AM

Zix - can you PM me - I need to buy your stuff…!

 

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# 6 ]

January 05, 2011, 02:03 AM

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/7663333.stm

 

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Lapwing

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# 7 ]

January 05, 2011, 02:20 AM

Stem cells is probably the route of the future(near future as well), but what about long term effects and cancer?  What are the risks?  Does anybody know?

Somebody somewhere has been confident over some cure for MPB over the last 50 years.  So confidence in itself doesn’t sell me.  Plus the FDA will most likely delay any real cure for many years, which could be good thing if there are real risks.  So best case scenario is that it won’t be available to the average american guy for about 6-7 years, even if they find cure tomorrow or found it last year.

And by cure, I mean total halting of hair loss plus significant regrowth on the order of 300 plus hairs per square inch in both temples and crown areas.  If you have major fibrotic scarring I don’t see how anything can help including stem cells.  Unless they can grow you a whole new scalp from the bottom up and somehow the old scarred follicles are sloughed off.  Fortunately I don’t have much fibrotic scarring or any slick bald areas. 

 

 

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# 8 ]

January 05, 2011, 03:03 AM

Lapwing -

I agree with what you said, but the only thing I can see the current establishment doing is achieving regrowth’s, root causes are rarely addressed in main stream science and in my opinion they’re miles and miles away from understanding it.  You’ll know we’re getting close when diebetes, Heart Disease, and Autoimmune diseases are vanquished.  Can’t see it happening soon, the people in power are making a fortune of of treating these things, getting new “clients” all the time.

... but that doesn’t mean we can’t or haven’t figured it out.


Of a suprahuman immensity in a patch of sand or a raptors guileless shivering intensity, I’m only a visitor,
an atom of atoms on a jutting red splattered synagogue of granite as it crouches literally in space
A frozen amoral giant gazing heavenward, forever

 

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# 9 ]

January 05, 2011, 06:54 AM

The idea of a conspiracy being around to suppress cures in order to make money off of treating symptoms makes for great fiction reading….but that’s it.  It’s has been around a long time but it doesn’t hold water.  The worst part is that it’s always based on an urban myth about a researcher some guy knows which implies it has a hint of credibility to it.  Look, beyond the fact that it’s entirely baseless with no credible proof, the notion is flawed simply because it doesn’t account for ambition and greed.  Suppose there really was a plot out there to stop cures from hitting the market. Eventually someone would leave the company with the knowledge of the “secret cure” in order to start their own company and make billions off of it.  I’m not saying the establishment hasn’t acted unethically and immorally….it most definitely has….and greed is a big reason for it….but there are no secret cures.  It’s a cold hard truth and we need to put these x-files conspiracy theories to rest.  If the cure was out there for diabetes, cancer…even hair loss….somebody would be screaming about it from the tops of their lungs.  The reality is science hasn’t progressed far enough yet to actually cure these things.  People have come up with great lines about treating symptoms over causes and the like but that isn’t based in reality…in many cases treating symptoms is simply the best science can do right now.


And Yes I know….most people on this site would not agree with me…but whatever, to each his own I guess


Tried a lot of things, never stuck with anything. Don’t do that

 

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# 10 ]

January 05, 2011, 07:57 AM

Hi MJ. I totally agree. But there is still a problem. There is no financial incentive to find a “cure”. So drug companies and researchers spend most of their time trying to find new treatments but not new cures. Even worse they spend most of their research making a slightly new compound for some drug that is marginally effective to begin with just so they can get a whole new patent and then charge premium prices for a drug that’s no better than the old generic drug.

First there was tagament, then axid, then pepcid. Each one had their run of patents that bilked Americans out of billions. They all work by the same mechanism and all have the same basic side effects.

Drug companies continue to play this game in variety of ways. First they came out with Fosamax a once a week pill for osteoporosis. Then as soon as that drug became generic they came out with Boniva…same basic pill only it’s now once a month. The game goes on. But if we could somehow take these resources we are sending to drug companies and use it prudently we could probably cure or prevent a whole load of diseases.

 

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# 11 ]

January 05, 2011, 01:48 PM

MJ - if you are working for a Big Pharma company and happen to find “a cure” the COMPANY owns the cure, not you. You can’t just up and leave and attempt to profit off it yourself.

I think you are extremely naive.

Walk into a dermatogists office and ask them to ‘cure’ your acne. They will give you all sorts of antibiotics, creams and other crap that does nothing but treat symptoms. They also have the hubris to tell you that diet has NOTHING to do with acne (completely false).

There absolutely is a cure for acne. But as zix states, there is no financial incentive for selling a “cure”.

 

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# 12 ]

January 05, 2011, 02:26 PM

scottyc33,

IF there is an absolute cure for acne then what is the cure?  And what is your proof?  I don’t believe there is a universal cure for acne.  Some stuff works for some and not for others.  It is a complex disease just like MPB and it is not easily eradicated once it has set it on someone. 

I know a lot of stuff that is benecial to helping with acne, but I don’t know of any true cure.  I agree diet is important but only so important.  Bactrim and tazorac were the best things I ever took for acne.  It totally cleared me up from my facial acne.

 

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# 13 ]

January 05, 2011, 02:36 PM

I didn’t mean to sound conspiratorial, what I mean is this, the modality of the allopathic industry is just not looking in the right ways or places to find cures.  It’s like looking for a lost, tiny piece of plastic, with a metal detector.


Of a suprahuman immensity in a patch of sand or a raptors guileless shivering intensity, I’m only a visitor,
an atom of atoms on a jutting red splattered synagogue of granite as it crouches literally in space
A frozen amoral giant gazing heavenward, forever

 

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January 05, 2011, 03:19 PM

Arguing as to whether cures are suppressed or not is pointless. Whether or not there is a nefarious intent to keep cures from ever hitting the market, the facts speak volumes for themselves. It is hard not to notice that 70 years of modern medicine, with what is likely trillions of dollars spent, has come up with very little by way of cures. Not to say alternative medicine is somehow that much more altruistic, I’d just as soon go to a conventional doctor than allow a stranger to beam his vibrational doctrine into the back of my head, but it is what it is when it comes to conventional medicine actually curing anything.

I don’t believe this article proves any root issue, but what is likely just another symptom. It is a good thing, though, that there is no difference in stem cell concentrations in balding and non balding areas, even if those cells are not being told correctly what to turn into by the body. It lends credence to the thought that something like Renokin could create new hair placode without the use of dermal disruption, as there could be as many stem cells as is the bare minimum necessary for such a process to work in the area already. I still wish we could get our hands on the peptides used in Renokin without all the other stuff, would make something like this much easier.

Also, as far as fibrosis goes, I do think it is possible to reverse maybe up to moderate cases of fibrotic scarring using Lugol’s solution. I know I am a broken record with this stuff, but it would blow your mind the kind of skin issues I have taken care of using heavy Lugol’s application. The only scar I have not been able to get rid of is my appendectomy scar, which is a 5cm x 1cm mass of pure scar tissue that goes all the way down into the muscle. I feel as though a 2-3 week Lugol’s bonanza on your hair bearing areas every 3-4 months or so would be highly beneficial in a number of ways. Besides the fact that I’d say it would do a pretty good number on fibrosis, the skin that is revealed after a few weeks of super heavy Lugol’s application looks and feels so much healthier that it is hard to imagine things like LLLT not working much better on it.

Honestly, it is a pain in the ass to use, and it is unsightly if used in an area others will see, but if anyone doubts just how effective the stuff is at skin rejuvenation, they should try it somewhere where no one will see faithfully for a month. Better yet, try it on the oldest scar you have. The only reason I’m not pushing this more vehemently for hair loss purposes is because of how hard it is to use, and how unsightly it is. Anyone who’s not concerned with either of those things should try it out.

(Iodine Question copied to this thread: http://www.worldhairloss.org/index.php/forums/viewthread/510)

 

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# 15 ]

January 05, 2011, 05:19 PM

FunkyStumpfighter,

Your name makes me think of that old Beatle’s song Paperback Writer.  It ryhmes and has the same cadence.  I am willing to try your Lugol’s solution on a scar on my leg as a test.  So how exactly do you treat scars to make them go away with Iodine?


(Iodine Question copied to this thread: http://www.worldhairloss.org/index.php/forums/viewthread/510)

 

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# 16 ]

January 05, 2011, 06:21 PM

I’ll send you a pm in a bit, as to keep from thread hijacking.

 

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mj

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# 17 ]

January 05, 2011, 09:00 PM

scotty I’m about as naive as you are paranoid….let’s keep the insults out of this.  Corporate espionage has been around about as long as corporations have existed so I don’t buy that anyone is sitting on secret cures.  There is no boogie man running the medical field hiding scientific miracles and there is no conspiracy to avoid researching new cures..that’s just a bad business model.  You can only spin off new drugs from old patents so many times before you’re left in the dust by other companies.  Eventually you need the next big thing. Pharma may try to stretch their old products longer than they should…but it’s profitable to do so….you should blame the sheep not the herder for falling for that one.  And it’s not just the medical field, how many versions of CoQ10 have you seen that are the “most absorbable”....give me a break…business is business no matter what field you’re in.

But enough on this from me, my point has been made, and I am by far the minority voice on this site on these matters


Tried a lot of things, never stuck with anything. Don’t do that

 

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# 18 ]

January 06, 2011, 03:01 AM

I think the incentive to get a cure for MPB is huge.  You get a fresh supply of new customers every generation.  The 100’s of billions dollars you would make is unbelievable.  Now the only problem business-wise would be if the cure was natural or something basic and not easily patentable.  There is a cure, it is called prevention.  If I knew 10 years ago what I know know, I could have prevented my MPB in its tracks.  I am not sure I could prevent a strongly genetic driven MPB though that some experience.

The real problem for science research is the mouse model doesn’t work for humans.  So the science just creeps at a snails pace, while they monkey around with mice that has no real application to humans except maybe for toxicity. 

So I don’t think there is a conspiracy when it comes to MPB.  It is just a complex problem with a lot a variables.  And human experimentation is very expensive and very time consuming.  Human hair cycles are so slow in themselves.  The science really needs 50 years of human research and 500 billion dollars to find the cure.  Good luck on that!

 

 

 

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# 19 ]

January 06, 2011, 06:49 AM

I think the incentive to get a cure for MPB is huge.  You get a fresh supply of new customers every generation.  The 100’s of billions dollars you would make is unbelievable.

Hi Lapwing. Probably 99.9% of all the compounds in the world are not patentable. Therefore the search for treatment and cure will be focused only on the compounds where a company can make money. Many times this tiny percentage of compounds is a much more unnatural substance that could potentially cause more side effects.

I don’t blame the companies so much as I blame the system. The system has a “glitch” and most of the compounds that could help us fight illness, disease, mpb will never be researched thoroughly.

 

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January 06, 2011, 10:10 AM

mj - January 05, 2011, 09:00 PM

I am by far the minority voice on this site on these matters

Why, does it bother you to be in the minority?

Think for yourself - most people are fools.

 

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Lapwing

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# 21 ]

January 06, 2011, 01:49 PM

Excellent point Zix Creator!  Thankfully for the internet and all the hair loss pioneers out there we can do a lot for ourselves now.

 

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